Hey guys,

I’m usually really excited when I see something new on Colorfabb’s website. But this new NGEN stuff has left me a little disappointed. Reading through the release, the dedicated site and the product page, all I see is some marketing mumbo-jumbo about the polymer ingredients. What I would actually like to know are the tangible advantages that NGEN has over something like XT.

Maybe with our united brain power, we can figure it out?

Happy guessing,

Jonas

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I compared the material properties given from Colorfabb.Com/materials Ngen is a tiny bit more flexible and can be used in a little hotter environments. All in all barely any difference. Ngen however isn’t foodsafe and that might be a major disadvantage for some of us. Ngen can be printed with lower temperatures which enables more printers to use this. Ngen is also a lot cheaper in colors, XT costs ~45€ and ngen just 35€. However XT costs just as much in clear and XT white, black and grey just cost 40€. I would’ve liked if the pictures on Colorfabb didn’t just show the spool but also sample prints. The main advantage for me is that ngen is available in dark blue and the price is better, there are generally more colors, but I hope those will appear in XT soon too (dark blue + white + grey is the best color combination). One thing I’m excited to find out about is how much friction ngen has compared to XT. this would be interesting to know about to find out which material is better for moving parts and gears. Cheers, Marius Breuer

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PS: XT is my main printing material, but because colors are so expensive in XT I ordered a total of 6,5 kg Ngen on Wednesday. I hope it arrives today or tomorrow so I can test it during the weekend. Otherwise I will print next weekend and will let you know my experience asap.

So lower printing temperatures, higher Tg, slightly more flexible and some ups and downs in terms of cost.

I think for gears, the higher Tg is going to be the most interesting parameter. There is nothing more embarrasing than fusing together a multi-stage gearbox during a demonstration. Then again, a lower friction coefficient might also correspond to less heat in the first place…

I tested nGen yesterday on a Zortrax M200 with Z-Temp temperature control, extruding at 235 degrees C. Unlike XT, which clicks and jams relentlessly on this setup, nGen extrudes and flows beautifully - it seems even more liquid-y than ABS. Layer precision is excellent, little or no stringing, and the finish is glossy. The metallic gold I bought is not very metallic at all, though. It is not entirely warp-free; I printed with a cold bed and maybe some heat would help. Much less warpage than ABS in any case. Raft removal was very easy, but removal of horizontal support interface material was challenging.

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Nice to hear about some printing experience. Sharing is caring!

Indeed, thanks for sharing @Julia_1! Do you have any photos of the prints by any chance? :smiley:

A simple knob.

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Frame piece, showing some warping (but no bed heat was used).

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Marius- Very interested to hear how nGen compares to XT! Please post your thoughts once you’ve got some experience with it. I’m planning to pick up one or the other sometime soon.

Hi Hartatak,

I’ve not yet been able to print that much with nGen, but I recieved my order of 6,6kg nGen a few days ago, so there are definitely some impressions i will be able to share when i get to printing.

So far here’s a report of what I noticed so far whilst printing with nGen, I do mostly compare nGen to XT in the following text as everyone (even Colorfabb) describes nGen as the “next level” of their Polyester filament line.

nGen is relatively easy to print, with a printing temperature of 220-240C it’s within the working range of most 3d printers, if you were confident with ABS you shouldn’t have a problem with nGen.

XT prints quite a bit hotter at 240-260C and usually has flow issues at the lower temperatures. The use of an volcano hotend (extended heat zone) is advised in both cases.

nGen needs a bit more temperature on the heated bed (80C) compared to XT (70C), but both are far less then ABS (110+C) and neither nGen nor XT show issues with warping.

Both materials can be stuck to the heated bed with buildTAK (unremovable if printed too close to the sticker) or just apply a bit of gluestick. The gluestick method is my preference, it’s easy to apply, quick to remove and the gluestick lets go off the print nearly completely when cooled down after printing.

nGen was a bit easier to get to stick to gluestick, use lower speeds if the lines don’t stick as well as they should.

nGen seems to be a tiny bit softer compared to XT, that’s especially noticable when drilling with a drill press, nGen gets cut like nothing else. Due to the higher glass transition temperature (usually equal to the bed temperature) nGen doesn’t create as much of a ridge at the drill hole ends.

nGen seems to be a little bit “weaker” in general when compared to XT.

I would describe nGen as the little brother of XT, it’s definitely an engineering plastic, but XT is still the non plus ultra.

Both filaments are very tough so the chances of the drive gear grinding trough the filament are very low.

nGen is available in a lot more colors, also those that were (and are) desperately waited for in XT (ie. dark blue).

If you want to give Colorfabb engineering plastics a go I would start with nGen due to ease of printing, availability in colors and the price tag.

nGen colors are up to 10€ cheaper (per spool) compared to XT.

Black, white and grey come 5€ cheaper and clear nGen / XT cost the same.

I still have a lot of clear and black XT in stock and I will definitely use that. It’s very hard to tell which material is “better”.

As I said earlier the two materials are very similar and the only times when you’d need to stick to one instead of the other is when there’s a very demanding application for which you could precisely tell what physical properties the 3d print should have. For 99,99% of all prints both XT and nGen will suit your needs.

In the long run i will most likely use nGen more often then XT, the main reason for that is the price.

I can imagine using XT for parts that need FDA approval (only XT is foodsafe), additionally XT has the advantage that it’s available as a carbon-fibre reinforced version called XT CF-20.

XT CF-20 is probably the strongest filament Colorfabb has produced this far, but due to the price tag of 50€ for 750g and the fact that you need a hardened nozzle I would only use it for parts that specifically need the stiffness of carbon fibres.

I’m excited to see what Colorfabb will release next, maybe they’ll expand the color portfolio of XT or release new colors like translucent ones. Other reinforcements (glass fibre, kevlar, …) might also give the edge over standard filaments.

PS: If you decide to buy nGen you will notice that certain grey colors are available as metalic or normal colors, I’ve been going with the normal dark grey and it has a bit of gloss to it, I don’t think the metalic look will make a big difference, if you need specific colors or effects you should allways consier going with a big spool of clear nGen / XT and then paint it.

XT was only glueable with super glue and adhesive spray or expoxy glue, i didn’t test any glue on nGen, but I guess the same ones will work. If possible you should allways avoid glueing either filament, handling large surfaces full of super glue and adhesive primers is a pain in the ass as you have about 3-5 seconds of working time, then the glue is dried completely. Epoxy glue works a bit easier but it smells terrible. I nearly allways design screw holes in one print and a hexagonal cutout in the second one. After printing i can use my vice to press fit a normal nut into the second print and then I can screw both halves together.

PPS: due to very low warping both filaments are recommended for large printers and you won’t need to split them apart to avoid warping, however you should keep an eye on the support removal, it’s sometimes very difficult to break nGen or XT support pillars away so only place support where you can easily remove it.

This review / comparison was written in multile parts so please excuse the lack of structure :wink:

Cheers,

Marius Breuer

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Wow, that is one detailed review you wrote up there! Thanks for sharing your experience so far!

For glueing printed parts together I would also advise against superglue (especially with activator) if there is anything bigger than a fingernail sized part to glue.

On the side of 2K-epoxies I’ve had quite good results with the UHU Endfest series. They are quite low odour for an epoxy glue and available in different size syringes depending on how frequently you use it. If you really want a nicer smelling way of bonding things, you might find structural adhesives for sandwich panel production more appealing. They can however reach exorbitant prices and take quite a while to cure if you can’t put the parts into an oven at 120°C for a few hours.

Sincerely,

Jonas

Hi all,

my test prints with ngen were pretty disappointing. All parts were brittle like crisp bread. Even PLA/PHA is much stronger than ngen.

I tested on two printers (printrbot and Ultimaker original+) with/without heatbed, with without part cooling, layers between 0,1 and 0,2mm - all parts broke very easy.

My question is if there are any other hubs having theese problems as it seems that I am the only one and therefore making some mistakes anywhere?

Any help is appreciated.

Cheers,

Joerg

Hey Joerg,

what temperature are you printing at? I’ve had similar problems with XT way back in the day, where the parts were delaminating really easily. Increasing the temperature to the upper quoted limit helped a lot.

Sincerely,

Jonas

oh sorry I forgot the tempereature: 235°C

Maybe going to 240 or even 250°C wil make things better. Depending on your hotend, the actual temperature inside the melt zone can vary a bit from what it says on the display.

ok, will try it, but I am afraid, that the surface quality will be worse then.

Marius, as usual, every time I read your comments, I feel like I strike gold! Thanks so much for sharing this.

So what do you think would be the best uses for nGen?

Marius-

Thank you very much for the detailed review/analysis of both materials. While I’m still not 100% certain which way I’ll go, I certainly know much more about what to expect with each. Most likely, I’ll pick up some of each and play with them both to see what works best on my Lulzbot Taz.

Thanks for being awesome.

-Brandon

test print at 247°C finished and… broke pretty easy - no difference to the print at 235°C.

I also printed the same parts in PLA and they were much stronger on both printers.

Even the Colorfabb team had no more ideas on how to improve the strength.

So for me it is clear that ngen is not the first choice for parts that are stressed like bottle openers, etc.

It would be interesting if somebody can approve or disprove my results.